Love Systems bootcamps originated with Mystery Method (the former name of the company). Some of the instructors were former Mystery Method instructors who trained under Mystery (Erik von Markovik). As a result some of the instructors have been coaching since early 2006.
Approaching Women•Attracting Women
This is a public service announcement: DO NOT WASTE YOUR MONEY ON THIS BOOTCAMP.
Reasons as to why:
1. The seminar material is not as new and innovative as the company advertises. I promise you that 95% of the material that I learned in the seminar portion of the bootcamp were things that I have read online for free. The things that we were taught were actually kind of dated and there was no way that the instructors themselves used the material.
2. The instructors were late to every single seminar and infield session and even left 20 minutes early the first night.
3. When actually in field, I and all of the other students CONSTANTLY asked the instructors if we could join them in set or if they could come into our set and give us suggestions, but every single time they gave us some bullshit excuse as to why they couldn't enter our sets.
4. The instructors cared more about approaching girls for themselves and would even get angry at you for entering their sets.
5. Only one of the two instructors had ANY skill in field.
6. The only feedback you will receive in field will be to watch your body language and will get generic comments from them post set like "good job" etc. etc.
7. The other students in my bootcamp were incredibly socially awkward and during the bootcamp they will be your wings which will scare away any potential set that you approach.
Therefore, if you can already approach girls and have any form of social skills, DO NOT take this bootcamp. They promise a money back guarantee but they have so many rules regarding getting your money back that you will definitely not get it back. I can speak from experience when I say that 3/4 students in my bootcamp session decided the bootcamp wasn't worth it by the last night....
I imagine that most people reading reviews like this one are guys trying to decide if shelling out three grand and a weekend of their life is either going to, (a) change their life for the better, like everyone says, or (b) just add up to another wasted 72+ hours and, even worse, a new monetary representation of just how big a failure their life is.
These are all questions I batted around for a few weeks when I was trying to decide whether this was a good idea or not. For those of you looking to compare, I'm mid-twenties, have had about a half-dozen partners, but lately have suffered some life setbacks and got LJBFd by a bunch of women, and it was screwing with my mind. I recognized that this was turning into a self-defeating pattern, and I realized that I didn't know why it was happening. I sensed that I would find the answer(s) at a bootcamp, even though I couldn't be sure. I decided that I would rather risk a failure than pass by the opportunity for success. I knew that if I didn't do it, I would always blame myself for not trying, and that would be so much worse than admitting afterward that it was a bad decision.
That being said, I have absolutely no regrets after taking the bootcamp, even though the dollars are still a little tight, and I still have a lot of growing to do. It turned out to be everything I expected it to be, which is saying a lot because my expectations were through the ceiling. But Fader in particular is the reason I got so much more out of it than I expected.
I have read Magic Bullets, the MM, The game, most of David D(I hate him so much, wasted so much money on his [stuff]).
The way Tenmagnet tought the class was much different then I expected, I thought it was pretty much going to be Magic Bullets all over again, but in a bit more detail. I was wrong, Tenmagnet pretty much tought us in a way that actually made a loooot more sence. I had a shitload of "aha" moments during the seminar....
If you are trying to get good at this and have read Magic Bullets, Mystery Method, The Game, DYD, or whatever the hell is out there. Take the seminar/bootcamp, I wish I could do the in field portion, but there are certain reasons that I can't YET, just 2 and a half more months till I can! It is a LOT different when these guys are showing you exactly how to do it.
Usually when I'm in class for 5 hours, I get BOOOORED EASILY, not once did that happen with these guys, time flew and not once did it drag on.
Tenmagnet and Cajun were awesome, I hope to definately go sarging with them(and I will), Jude was another new instructor, I think it was his first time as a instructor and he had nothing but good advice to give. Very cool guy. One thing that I think its really cool that Tenmagnet is from my city, it will be a lot easier to meet up with him for 1 on 1's and it helps when they know your city. All the guys there were super cool too, made some new friends and yeah. Real eye opener. If you are serious about this shit, then I think it is obvious to do this. I think this changed my life.
BTW when I asked the students how Tenmag and Cajun did in the field, their answer..."these guys are legends."
Like Miaddict said, Tenmagnet is really good at getting what he has in his head, into your head. He doesn't fluff on a subject for 3 hours, he breaks it down in a way thats so simple to understand. Everything I have read in the past few months, I'd have to say that I learned more from Tenmagnet in a few hours than I have in all the books and products I have ordered(which is like probably over 100 hours of material).
Would You Recommend It?
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Reviewed by RoutineSpittinAnimal September 27, 2009
I must first say that my experience at the charlotte bootcamp with Fader rocked , ( the man pulled a stripper !!! )not only was he a great instructor he now is also my friend . so fellas lets break it down , you've researched enough , read or studied some of the information available out there ( I highly recommend MAGIC BULLETS its the holy grail ) and have got far enough in your own understanding to consider a bootcamp . You want more . This is where I speak from experience , I too sat where you are now . After taking the bootcamp with fader the game changed for me , it wasn't text or theory anymore it was real !
...to sum it up , Im just like you but the bootcamp has changed me. If your thinking about a bootcamp stop thinking and do it! also to Fader I say THANK YOU dude your a hell of a guy and I take what i learned from you with me everday. But watch out , up your game b#tchs there is a new player in town and the next stripper is hitmans!!!!!!!!!
This was the first bootcamp I attended and overall it was a good experience. Fader takes the training seriously, and I felt that he had a good mastery of the material. The workshop is broken down into three afternoon sessions (Fri, Sat, Sun) followed by two evening sessions at the local clubs (Fri, Sat). The afternoon sessions were held in Fader’s hotel room. Most of the teaching comes from notes Fader reads from his computer, and there is sufficient opportunity to ask questions and discuss the information. I took 36 pages of notes. Make sure you bring a notebook to write everything down. It is not possible to cover the complete psychology of dating in 2 ½ days. This was an introductory course to the topic and it allowed me to begin recognizing both the positive (successful) and negative (unsuccessful) behaviors I exhibit, as well as understand better the overall framework of dating. I came to the course with reasonable expectations, not planning to become a Don Juan by the end of the course, but hoping to be able to learn about and begin utilizing the basic tools to develop my personality and game better.
I recommend this bootcamp and Fader as an instructor. Fader is a good guy and will work with his students. He is very responsive and is interested in his students’ understanding of the material and progress. There were two other students at my bootcamp, and I enjoyed their company greatly. I thought our group had great chemistry and I was able to learn a lot from the other guys as well. I think I was probably the “weak link.” Fader purposely kept his bootcamp smaller, and this was a huge benefit. If I had any suggestions for a better bootcamp, it would be to research the city and the venues beforehand, so that there would be a short-list of the clubs to visit. Next time, I would also suggest that Fader stay in downtown Charlotte, where the clubs and better hotels are located. Thanks, Fader, for everything. I would guess, years from now, I will look back on our weekend, and appreciate the truly life-changing experience it was.
Attending this workshop was one of the BEST DECISIONS I have ever made.
When I met Fader, I could tell that this weekend was going to change my life. His passion and experience, along with his honesty with himself and others sets him and his workshops apart, in that it will lay a strong foundation for the rest of your life.
Fader’s teaching method is not only comprehensive in the sense that he is actively still learning from the other “masters” so that he can pass this along to his students but also very intelligent in that he teaches his students the psychology and the “why” behind what works and what doesn’t work so that you can understand your future sticking points and resolve them on your own.
I highly recommend the field portion of the program with Fader – that is where I learned how to think on my feet and correct any actions that were not helping me meet my objectives. Being new, Fader knows where people get stuck and will correct what needs to be corrected.
It also gave us an opportunity to watch Fader in action – which will speed your learning curve tremendously. Fader showed no fear in going up to women (he will teach you why) and was able to create attraction / comfort / seduction situations that I frankly thought were impossible. One student said that the in field portion of the bootcamp was well worth the price of admission. I definitely agree.
A few recommendations for attending his sessions:
• Come with an open mind and be prepared for your life to change
• Come well rested (Fader has a TON of experience and wants to share as much as he can
• On that note, bring a laptop (way too much to jot down on a notepad)
• Stay in the same hotel as Fader – just makes the logistics easier
My goal for this workshop was to learn how to approach women in different settings and push myself through the different stages of the model. I know that what I learned this past weekend has made an incredible difference already and will allow me to pursue the opportunities I choose in the future.
"The Amount of Learning Opportunity is Totally Exhausting!"
Instructor(s) for Coaching:
Date Program Took Place:
May 29, 2009
Fader is an instructor that is really clear about the lovesystem models and game in general, but thats just the beginning. His zest and enthesiasm for life personifies the concept of 'self amusement'. It wasn't just the stripper that he closed from the extra field time he gave us, but the investment banker that was sending him drinks and hitting on him just from picking up his vibe
from afar. It was one hell of an example.
Perhaps this is why Fader starts his Bootcamp lecture with inner game, to show his students the connection. Fader went the extra mile by sharing his life experiences to demonstrate how his inner game evolved and directly impacts game.
Moreover, he limits his class size and this allows for in depth, no holds barred,questions from students at any level. Having attended larger LS bootcamps, this feature really sets Fader apart (but all bootcamps I have attended have been good-no shit). The opportunity to stop and probe deeper really is unique and makes game clearer.
Fader's field critique's were right on for all of us. He was quite observant even
while teaching by example by opening many sets of his own. Fader gave each of the 'next step' to take to get to the next level.
If I have a critizicism, it would be the amount of learning opportunity is totally exhausting! So take advantage of every second of his Bootcamp!
I had my doubts about bootcamps. For one thing it was the cost and another the travel. Fader made it worthwhile. I recently bought Savoy's 'magic bullets' couple weeks ago. Finished it and wanted to put theory into practice. Signed up for LA bootcamp but was too late it soldout. I was redirected to Houston. Don't know anything about the community or reputation of instructors! Got off the plane on Friday and went directly to meet Fader in the hotel. My first impression was he seem very charismatic. We got going on the material immediately. I have to say the lecture was intense. So much to learn and so little time! Fader is very knowledgable in the pickup game. That night we went out and watch him in action. First set of two bitches he got shot down immediately. Good to see that it didn't bother him. He went straight into another set. We ended going to another venue where we saw him number closed twice! It was fun seeing him do his thing. He made everyone opened a set and apply what we learned earlier. The night ended well. Next day we continued with lecture material and we went to out again to apply what we learned. Pretty much everyone opened sets and number closed. So proud of my group. We ended up meeting the dj after the club closed and hang out with him at a strip club and afterhour club. What a night! The next day we continued with lecture. Fader is a great instructor. He knows his shit! He's a walking encyclopedia of pick games. More importantly he's approachable, kind and honest. I think if you are thinking about a bootcamp you should signup with Fader and go through with it. I'm glad I did. Thanks Fader you're the best!!!
Sorry for the delay in writing this review, unfortunately life seems to have caught me with me right after the bootcamp. I want to make sure this is a review and not another field report (though we all had much to report, ?).
Ok I couldn’t resist.
a) Managed to play 8-9 even at times 10 game
b) Paid for less than 20% of my drinks.
c) Had my standards wrenched up.
d) Two weeks of returning from camp got six phone closes of 8-9 and one 10.
e) Was so wired on the material that I picked up a 9 three rows behind me in the airplane, and went on a date immediately on landing.
Mr. M is the guy you want as your friend, who has your back. Not because he’s the all American quarterback who you want to make sure is a part of your network, but because he is truly a nice guy and a great human being. What astonished me was he absolute commitment to making sure everyone in the bootcamp learned to their full potential. That meant for those who were doing really well to up the ante, and for those who were struggling or were losing heart to sometimes chase after them to make sure they benefited from attending. I was impressed with his ability to sort through his own personal opinions and the official materials, he was very careful to make sure that we knew exactly what we learning, and had a properly structure around it. You immediately see he is quite intelligent, and is able to make dry theory come alive with stories, graphs, and plain good old fashion humor. I was worried that the length of the theory part would make the camp tedious, but time flew by very quickly. He is extremely honest, in terms of his praise and criticism, but also in terms of what you can do and what you cannot do with the knowledge gained. I appreciated his firm grounding in reality, which gave much more credibility to his words, and certainly gave us all realistic achievable goals. Much of what you learn is the dispelling of myths.
To put it in a single sentence, Mr. M makes your learning his personal responsibility, and having attending the best schools in the world, I can truly appreciate how rare and wonderful that is.
The Support Team
Mr. M could not have been as successful with it wasn’t for his A star support team, both in PUAs and approach coaches. These guys were absolutely selfless in their quest to make sure that you learnt and you were successful. This often involved jumping on grenades, which at times was truly painful to watch. My goal in field nights was to try out every single routine and theory I had learnt, and much of these came from the support team that rocked. Through the theory lessons they were able to add their own unique perspectives and understanding, as well as ensure that an eight-person classroom felt more like a one on one lesson. Each of them was a master at an aspect of them game, and in their element it was incredible to watch. With them present there was always someone you could ask a question, get a clarification from, or simply do a try run of an approach and get instant feedback.
Highroller – thanks man, you were awesome.
Mr. M is a great advocate of what he calls “the man game” direct approaches with sexual intent that quickly establish what the night is going to be all about. Thus, apart from learning the regular official content, we were treated to his own (and of the support team’s) personal game insights. What made it work brilliantly was their ability to clearly indicate what the source of the insight was, and to credit the different PUAs with them. Often these were at odds with the official materials, but the conflicts were clearly stated and drawn out.
Having read the book “The Game” it was refreshing and relieving to see that the PUA community had continued to innovate and develop strategy and tactics. Much has changed since the publication of the book, and would encourage anybody who has read it to take a bootcamp to update themselves on the latest thought processes, and practical applications of this.
I will give words of warning though, like all knowledge, the tools and skills here are ethically neutral. They can be wielded for great good, or for great evil, and for most people somewhere in between. “With great power comes great responsibility” (Spiderman). I would encourage everyone to watch the movie “Dangerous Liaisons” (1997) with an all star cast, as a reality check on how you want to use this knowledge, and even the possibilities both for right and wrong.
Why the bootcamp?
Apart from all the stuff above, I really bought into the need for attending a bootocamp. There is something to be said for a group of individuals entering a club together with a single purpose, and being able to help and criticize each other through the process. I was shocked at some of the transformations that took place. Within a few nights shy people had become confident and outgoing, individuals who could hardly speak to girls were now figuring out how to handle 2-3 at a time. The bootcamp is an accelerated learning experience, and a great way to get some structure and personalized feedback. I also think I made some great friends, and look forward to keeping in touch with them. ?
I took the bootcamp because picking up women has been a hobby of mine for quite some time. I mainly did it trough body language, untill a few months ago when i discovered the mystery method, realized that i was missing real game, and from there on started reading everything on game i could get my hands on, and been applying it succesfully.
Getting with a higher caliber women consistently was my aim. However, seeing a pro in action and getting a deeper understanding of the emotional progression model were also strong motivators.
First of all I thought that mr. m was an awesome guy, and very inspiring, just like keychain, vercetti, and soul.
The seminar part was a lot of stuff i already knew, that bothered me a bit, luckely mr m answered every specific question i had and this helped me get those parts i didnt put together in my head yet.
the in field part of day 1 was a lot of opening, i felt good getting pushed into sets a lot, although in my opinion the girls werent that hot.
mr m did some awesome demonstrations, i saw right away how good he was.
I opened every girl i found a little attractive, but as i said, they werent really hot by my standards. I Kiss and # closed one of the cute girls i approached, but this wasnt really anything special for me.
The seminar part was again a lot i already knew(dont get me wrong, i didnt expect anything really new, when u know it u know it, right?), but it also was very helpful to have it explained personally by mr m.
that day i was really hoping i would get to do what i wanted to do, which was learn how to cold approach 9's and 10's, or at least work on my transitioning and qualifying.
But again, the girls didnt really meet my standards, and they were hard to open, because it was a low end club and the girls there were just so used to brushing of all those losers, that they didnt wanna talk to anybody, i think. T l;east it made it harder for me.
Come to think of it, i might also just have been tired from the night before and it was affecting my game.
Soul, vercetti and keychain all did very nice demonstrations and i got great advice from all of them. Which applied, it worked, but... not on the high caliber women i wantedto try it on because they just werent there this was kinda frustrating, i'm sure everybody noticed that it affected my mood at the end of the night. I always have this when i'm in western europe, just the low caliber women... it's hard to accept when u r not used to it.
day 3 was a lot of fun, we discussed a loit that happened i really enjoyed hearing from other guys that they had some successes, made me feel good
I was really tired though.
Alot of useful things were said.
At the end i felt like i didnt really get to do what i wanted to do though. i had a lot of mixed feelings about it. At one point the fact that i met the instructors was inspiring for me, and it WAS a great experience all together. But i wanted to practice cold approaches on 9's and 10's and that just wasnt what i had done.
Thinking the whole thing over as i'm back in poznan, i DO feel like i had a lifechanging experience, i really do... but i still didnt have and instructor present as i was gaming those super hot, bitchy, polish 10's(in western europe these would be 11's and 12's i guess, but for me they arent. I do pick up polish 8's and sometimes 9's and i guess over there they would be 10's)
I can't help but be a bit disapoiinted by it, after all... it was the main reason i wanted to come as this was the one thing i really felt i needed help with, and at that point.. i think i'm still where i was.
Before i took the bootcamp, the program manager told me that after this bootcamp i would have the confidence and the skillset to approach any 9 or 10 i saw walking down the street, i gotta tell u... this isnt true.
what also bothered me was that everybody was so 'impressed' or whatever when i kissed that girl or when another girl was all over me.. really.. for me that was nothing special what so ever, it actually felt more like a step down than anything else maybe i should've taken an advanced bootcamp, but i dont really see myself as advanced, i mean.. WHAT IS ADVANCED?? right?
it WAS absolutely a great experience.
Mr M, Keychain, Vercetti, and Soul, are absolute AWESOME guys that i'm happy to have had the privelege to meet, and get their advice.
I feel changed, i'll let time tell how much.. i just don't know yet.
right after the bootcamp i started calling all my girls and in conversations with them i noticed how i was using the personal advice mr m gave and it really felt good
I also feel like it might do my proffesional life much good, but as said.. time will tell.
ps. i wanted to give u guys a few pics with me and my polish girls, to show u that i wasnt exaggerating when i was talking about how hot polish girls are. I will post the pics in the lounge when i'll get access, for privacy reasons.
ok I wanna come back on a few issues here.
Today i number closed a 9 in the shopping mall. i never did that before. i have to credit soul for this completely.
so.. after all, i did learn a lot. I can feel it, i'm a changed man
i was just in such a bad mood because the women in germany were so ugly compared to the women im used to in poland that i thought i didnt practise what i wanted.