Ep. #44 The Role of Sex in Relationships with Jason Julius

[Angel Donovan]: This is Angel Donovan back with another episode of Dating Skills Podcast. This is Episode 44, and this week we're going to focus on the role of sex in relationships. We've talked about sex before but we haven't gone deep into what its impact is on a long-term relationship that you want to stay healthy and you want to make the most of. So we're going to be looking today at things like how it contributes to relationships, how sex in the bedroom affects behavior outside of the bedroom, and what kind of signals you should be looking for? What damage does bad or lazy or low-effort sex do to relationships? Are you settling for a much more limited experience of sex than you should be? Practical tips on how to use sex to improve your relationship and make sure that it lasts and is a healthy relationship for the long-term. So this is all looking at the relationship side and impacts of sex and working through sex with practical tips about sex that can improve your relationship.

And to talk about this subject today, we're going to have a guy on today that I have been trying to chase down for a while, and the reason is that when we've reviewed his course earlier this year, right at the start of this year, called The Female Orgasm Blueprint, we decided that it was the best sexual skills course that we had found to date. So it is still there, it is still at number one for sexual skills. So given how many courses we've now reviewed, you'll have seen how many reviews we've done, it's really saying something if it's at the top of our list and it's staying there. It's no easy feat. And the guy behind this course is the man from Orgasm Art. His name is Jason Julius.

And Jason Julius is really a relationship man and around 75% of his clients, men mostly, are in relationships themselves. They're either married or they're in long-term relationships, and they're using his courses and his advice and his consulting to improve their relationships and their sex lives. So he was really the perfect guy to talk about this aspect of sex and get deep into that. And also because in his personal life he's a lot more relationship-focused than some of the other people we have on this show.

Hey Jason, it's great to have you on Dating Skills Podcast this week. How are you doing?

[Jason Julius]: I'm doing great, man. Thanks for having me.

[Angel Donovan]: No, it's great to have you here. Like we've wanted to get you on the show for a while, so really glad that we could connect and get this all sorted out. So to jump into the interview, first of all, I'd like to give everyone a really good idea of where you're at in your life and what you're doing – dating, sex and relationships. So where do you live, hang out these days? What’s your lifestyle like?

[Jason Julius]: I reside in sunny San Diego, Southern California. I absolutely love it. I actually grew up in the Midwest, so this is absolutely amazing to me. I've lived here for about five years now. I used to live in Las Vegas before this. And yeah, just love it here. Weather’s great, man. Lifestyle, pretty relaxed. That's what I love. I'm a pretty relaxed, chill kind of guy. I can't complain about the women here. It's not a hardship to be celibate. You're going down to the beach or… you get such a variety of people that visit this city that you meet exotic women from all over the world.

[Angel Donovan]: Right. Yeah, that's amazing. And there's a lot to be said for the beach environment. I'm on a beach here in Mexico and people come in all day here. It's great to go down to the beach and just watch lots of beautiful bodies running past. [Laughs]

[Jason Julius]: Oh yes. [Laughs]

[Angel Donovan]: So how old are you, man?

[Jason Julius]: I'm 32.

[Angel Donovan]: Great, great. And have you been in a lot of relationships? What’s kind of your relationship lifestyle? Do you have like short relationships, long relationships? What’s the longest relationship you've had?

[Jason Julius]: Longest relationship I've had is about a year and a half, to be honest.

[Angel Donovan]: Okay.

[Jason Julius]: And I wouldn't say that I'm the typical pickup artist or anything like that where I pick up tons of women. You know, I probably slept with more women than most of your average guys, but at the same time I get a lot more fulfillment out of creating a really great sex life with a woman that I connect with. I don't think a lot of guys spend enough time being choosy enough to find a woman that they connect with sexually. Instead they try to make it work with one that they think is so hot on the outside but maybe they don’t connect with on a deeper level than that.

So right now I'm actually single, and I love it because more than ever, more than when I was in my 20s, I'm more particular about the type of woman I meet. What that allows you to do is you walk up and you talk to a girl and it's not like you have any expectations even if she's really hot because you get the chance to figure out who she is before you get all anxious about whether or not it's going to happen for you. So I think that helps a lot. I mean, I think it helps to be the choosy type of a guy.

[Angel Donovan]: Totally. You know, I think it leads to a much more satisfactory life. And it's kind of an evolution, right? I think a lot of guys who first get into this, it's not what they focus on but eventually it becomes a bigger focus and they get happier and more satisfied with all of this as they do that. But yeah, it's definitely not where most people start.

When you say you're single, what does that kind of mean? Are you kind of seeing like friends with benefits, like you've kind of got these casual relationships or do you meet girls from time to time?

[Jason Julius]: For me, you know, right now it's not one particular girl. I am actually enjoying being single because I'm really going to work on myself for great purposes, and I think that's something that a lot of guys don’t do, is go to work on themselves, their fitness, their business, their wealth and improving themselves in all areas. And what I find is that I really get to know myself a lot more if I go through these periods of time where maybe I'm just not as focused on picking up women, and then that stuff kind of just starts to take care of itself.

Coming from a place of 10 years ago or so, you know, I had a lot of anxieties around sex, I got into the whole pickup-dating-type stuff, and I loved the idea of going out and meeting women and knowing what to say and all those kinds of things, but as you progress on you realize that the more you work on yourself, the more you don’t have to worry about those types of things. So I'm not concerned about, do I have friends with benefit because that could possibly happen tomorrow. That's more organic. But right now I absolutely love going through these periods of times where I'm just really focused on particular things like my work or creating products that I create.

[Angel Donovan]: Right, and I totally get you and, you know, I've actually done exactly the same thing. Myself, you know, I go through phases where I want to be more alone and I'm building a business or I'm pursuing some other goals, and like you say, it's kind of like investment in yourself and you get a lot out of those periods of your life as well. And then, you know, you go through another phase wherein you're either seeing more girls or you're getting more and putting more into a relationship. So I can really connect with what you're doing there and…

[Jason Julius]: Yeah, it's kind of going off balance. Sometimes I know I've been guilty when I am seeing a woman that I really care about, I may neglect other areas in my life, and I like to build those areas up while that's a focus for me so that when I do have a woman that I particular connect to, you can wake up in the morning and have sex all day and not worry about working and things like that, you know? So sometimes you just go off balance so you can enjoy the other times.

[Angel Donovan]: so how many women have you slept with? You said you slept with a fair number. How many has it been for your lifetime?

[Jason Julius]: I honestly have no idea. I don’t really keep track. [Laughs]

[Angel Donovan]: Okay, okay.

[Jason Julius]: Yeah, I would say probably around 40. I'm not a numbers kind of a guy. Like I said, I went through stages in my 20s where it was like, yay, I'm going out to the clubs and meeting women. I really like having something deeper than that these days just because it's more fulfilling, and sex just becomes something on another level.

[Angel Donovan]: Right, totally. And that's what we're going to be talking about today, so I'm looking forward to getting to our discussion. And just before we move on to that, how has your dating, sex and relationships lifestyle kind of changed over the last five or 10 years that you've been kind of studying this and changing aspects of this for yourself?

[Jason Julius]: That's a good question, man, because it's kind of what I was alluding to earlier, and I think it's more about just becoming a guy of high value and worrying less. It seems to be something that maybe comes with experience and age that you start to worry less about what you're going to say. You start to have enough reference points in your own brain that this cute girl you're going to go talk to probably has her own insecurities, she probably has her own hangups, so don’t get too caught up in any kind of outcome, and it just kind of allows you to relax.

When you're kind of just really into what you do, you know, maybe it's running your business, maybe you're really into your fitness, maybe you're learning multiple languages, maybe you give back to charities and you're involved with that kind of stuff, when that preoccupies most of your being and who you are, you organically sort of come off as somebody who’s interesting, whereas pickup lines and things of that nature sort of make up for the fact that you haven't gone to work on yourself and become that kind of guy, which is totally fine because I get that. I was totally into that kind of stuff maybe eight to 10 years ago and I think it kind of helps you build some confidence for yourself, particularly if you're not somebody who’s really a social person that likes to go out a lot, so it kind of helps you to relax knowing some stuff, but ultimately it's about becoming organic.

And maybe that's a little bit cliché in the dating world, but it's kind of actually the ultimate goal, is to not have to think, not have to concern yourself with what are you doing, what are you saying, or how the pickup is going, so to speak. You have more choice when you can just come off as a guy who has his shit together and has some interesting stuff going on other than trying to meet her and bring her back to your home and have sex with her.

[Angel Donovan]: Yeah, yeah. So while you were saying that I was thinking of kind of like a way to describe that whole thing, and it's kind of like you're engaging with your life, right? We hear kind of like a lot of things about being passionate in your life is a good thing, but it's kind of like you're investing and you're being engaged with your own life, and if you're not doing that you're not really living, you know, women and men, pickup or not. Is that a decent way of looking at it? Is that a way you'd look at it?

[Jason Julius]: Absolutely. I think women are attracted to men who love to grow, men who love to dominate, men who believe in themselves. I was watching a video on YouTube the other day. It was P. Diddy. It was like an old video. But it was funny because he was just absolutely convinced that he's the baddest motherfucker alive…

[Angel Donovan]: [Laughs]

[Jason Julius]: …and there's just no question in his mind. That's how he's been able to do all the things in his life, is he absolutely believes he's the baddest motherfucker alive. When you start getting into dating and stuff like that, if you don’t have a lot going on or maybe you're just on your way up, you may not have a lot to show for it. But if you're convinced yourself that you're on way there and you're the baddest motherfucker alive, it just kind of radiates from you. I really believe that as you actually are more experienced you get more competence as to what’s going on, and that builds the confidence that comes off naturally.

[Angel Donovan]: Well, let's dive into the topic of today, which is the role of sex in relationships. So you've already been talking how like you really enjoy relationships, and I know your courses in general are more focused on getting the most out of sex in relationships. So what is it about giving a girl good sex in relationships that is important? What is it that translates to a better quality of the relationship or prevents it from becoming a negative relationship?

[Jason Julius]: Really we’re the most hypersexual species on this earth, and to underestimate a woman’s sexuality is a huge mistake. Women are just as sexual as men and they enjoy sex. They want to get fucked by a guy that they desire. Being able to be competent in that area allows you to give her a level of orgasm that she might not be even aware of that she can even have.

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: What I mean by that is we kind of like live in this bubble where sexuality is still not talked about all that much, and for women they're confused on what they're even capable as far as sex goes to begin with. They grow up like a lot of us all do with a lot of shame in things about sex, and so when you take the time to understand what it means for a woman’s mind and body to come together to be in a full state of desire and feeling desired, being able to get out of her head and all those things in order to ultimately have a full body orgasm, then you can actually give her a level of like primal fulfillment that most guys don’t do. And I think that's important in a relationship, obviously, because that's your sexual relationship. That's your sexual partner. Being exciting, bringing new stuff, new techniques, so to speak, to the table is important. It makes you unpredictable.

On the flipside of that, when you become boring in the bedroom, which is what a lot of guys do—a lot of guys just think you stick it in and out and women are just supposed to have an orgasm. There are never any sexual role models. I know myself I didn't have any sexual role models. Everybody’s so quiet about sex, and so we're left to our own judgments about what that means, and a lot of times guys will look to things like pornography. They’ll see the upper 1% of guys with huge dicks and think that their dick is tiny and that they’ll never be able to give a woman an orgasm and they're inferior with their masculinity. All those things start to really fuck a guy up, not to mention when you're 15, 16 years old, you're going through puberty and you have all these…you're probably at the horniest time in your life and nobody’s talking to you about that. Women just seem like this elusive thing that isn't going to happen for you. So you start to, again, make all kinds of judgments about what that means. But in healthy sexual relationship, each partner can really be themselves sexually and let out their inner desires and not feel shameful about it.

But in a lot of those relationships where the guy’s really unaware of her sexuality, what she's capable of, is mainly just concerned about getting his orgasm out, it becomes really boring for her. Even if she doesn’t know she's capable of full body orgasms, something inside of her is going to just start to get really frustrated. So when she's not getting that fulfillment in the bedroom, a lot of times that frustration will come out in the relationship. She'll have a short fuse and she might not even know why. She might become like irritable and dismissive and things like that, and she may even start to like lose trust.

So she may not even like trust and respect you. It's not really happening on a conscious level. It's just something inside of her is telling her that there's something more and she's not getting it. When she starts to doubt your competence in the bedroom, she'll doubt you in other areas of your life. And that's where women really find you desirable and attractive, is when you are competent in life, you know what you're doing, you move in a way that you dictate reality, reality is not dictated to you. When you show up wimpy in the bedroom, that starts to ring some bells in her brain that something’s kind of not right, and she starts to lose attraction.

And that's why you see so many relationships start to head downhill that never really had to. I mean, those are two people that at one point probably had somewhat of an exciting sexual relationship. Then that fizzles out because there is no conscious effort to actually keep that up. That's the big missing piece in terms of like long-term. I have so many clients that email me and they're like, “Oh my God, I've been married for 15 years and I didn't know my wife could have an orgasm like this. We're having orgasms in our 40s and 50s unlike anything we've had prior to this.” It's so exciting. It reawakens a part of her that's been dormant for pretty much forever. There's just a deeper level of fulfillment and connection that comes from it.

I would say that it's not really about necessarily orgasms. It's actually part of your masculinity to actually know a woman’s body and be able to be masterful of creating an orgasmic experience. It transcends into so much of your life. It gives you confidence and really transfers over to your wealth creation, your influence and things of that nature.

Actually, I just saw an article by a…I can't remember what site it was on but it was actually about Steve Jobs’ former lover was talking about what a great lover he was. And you look at someone like Steve Jobs, what an influential, powerful guy he is, I think that sometimes those things go hand in hand. The guys who create power, who are powerful guys, are also typically very competent and confident in themselves in the bedroom.

[Angel Donovan]: Man, you touched on so many different topics there. Let me…

[Jason Julius]: Yeah, I know. I have a habit of rattling off a lot stuff at one time.

[Angel Donovan]: Lots of great stuff. Luckily I'm taking notes, so I'm going to cross back…

[Jason Julius]: Sure.

[Angel Donovan]: …on a bunch of those because, you know, I think it's worth talking about more of them. The first part is talking about like how I think men aren't aware of what they should be aiming for. They're given kind of very bad role models. You were talking about the porn industry, and if you look at movies and whatever, you know, potentially what they heard from their parents, but most guys don’t hear much from their parents, and also their friends as they're growing up, even into their 20s and 30s. A lot of men, we don’t talk authentically with each other when we're younger, and I think once you get into this kind of area or study in self-development stuff, you learn to do that better, but I think for the majority of men out there, they don’t really talk to each other on a real level. So when they're talking about sexuality and stuff, they're not talking authentically and they're setting the wrong expectations for each other in terms of what sex should be about, and actually they're lowering the bar.

So I think this is one of the problems you've just outlined there, is that men don't know what they should be aiming for in terms of giving a woman a good experience and in terms of having a great sexual life and how important it is. Does that explain and could you go further into that?

[Jason Julius]: Sure, absolutely. I mean, I myself didn't have very strong sexual role models. My parents were pretty much sort of the typical relationship where they didn't, you know, maybe it would be a peck on the lips and there was really no spark there. They eventually ended up getting divorced. And you see that in obviously over 50% of relationships, and so there's no passion role models.

I actually had a woman client who actually got my program on female orgasms, which I made for guys, and she loved it so much that she actually has put it in a time capsule for her son when he turns 18 because she said she has never heard it articulated that way. And it's really a shame because most guys don’t get the education of what women are capable of. It's not a lot of work to make a woman sexually satisfied when you know what’s going on down there. It's just a matter of being, you know, clued into what’s happening there. Steve Jobs, what an influential, powerful guy he is, I think that sometimes those things go—they’ve actually done studies where they put a woman in the machine, scanned her brain, and the prefrontal cortex, the thinking part of the brain, actually quiets down.

[Angel Donovan]: Mm-hmm.

[Jason Julius]: But for a lot of women that doesn’t quiet down. There's a lot of insecurities around sex, and both guys and girls, we all have them. And when she's able to actually let go and turn that part of her brain off, then something on a whole new level happens. That's an important thing to understand in of itself, but then the other half of that is understanding how to touch her, you know, knowing what’s going on down there.

Most guys are clueless. I mean, you look at a vagina and it doesn’t come with instructions, you know? There's like all these different parts. There's, you know, her clitoris, which is super-sensitive. And then you have porn showing guys flicking their tongue on a woman’s clitoris, which you should absolutely never do because in most cases it can be overly sensitive and actually be uncomfortable for her. Then on the inside there's the G-spot, you know, A-spot, all those kinds of things. So it sounds intimidating.

But the reality is, when you get to know all those things and you understand how to bring a woman into the present and be able to let go, you can actually give her an orgasm before sex even begins, and then she is like a thousand times more likely to have another orgasm once you do have sex. Then, eventually, she'll be so conditioned to come with your cock inside of her that you may never have to do that too much again. It's good to take the time to do that, but it's kind of actually understanding those things.

That to me is so outside of what I grew up learning about and I had so much sexual anxiety when—about 10 years ago I had a girlfriend, she cheated on me, and then after that I was so concerned if it was my performance, so to speak, which kind of led me on the path of like wanting to discover all this stuff. It really opened my eyes that the way we look at sex is so blind that most of us are just shooting in the dark and we don’t really have the competence of what’s really going on there. And then we're inundated with all these things like 101 sex positions to be better at sex…

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: …when in reality there's only three useful sex positions.

[Angel Donovan]: Yeah, that's one of the worst things. It's all in magazines and men’s magazines and women’s magazines and all the books you see in the shops, are all about all of these crazy positions, which is just a huge distraction.

[Jason Julius]: Exactly. Exactly. I mean, any of those positions, if you know how to aim the head of your penis at the G-spot, you're more likely to probably stimulate her to orgasm. But if the whole time she's thinking about how self-conscious she is, it's never going to happen, so what’s the point of tangling yourself up in the first place?

So all that stuff seems to be missing but it's coming to light a lot more. We have to really look at where we are in the context of history. You know, Kinsey had his book about female sexuality about 70-some years ago, and he was condemned by all sorts of groups, and pretty much his career was really in question because he actually said women are sexual too. And you know, that's like only a lifetime, not even a lifetime ago, where people were just so clueless about women and sex, and we're just kind of coming out of the dark. Women are learning about their own bodies or learning that they're capable of squirting, they're capable of like these full body amazing orgasms, they're capable of 50 orgasms at a time. The most I've ever given a woman is like 30-some orgasms, but I had a woman email and I think she said she had gone over 50. So it's amazing, you know. And these are women who have never had an orgasm before. Some of them are in their 30s, 40s, 50s, some in their 60s even, and they're awakening this part of their body.

And when you're a guy and you know that you can awaken that part of a woman, and you're walking down the street and you want to go up and meet a woman and ask her to hang out with you, like how much more confidence do you have when you are just totally solid knowing that you're going to be able to give her an orgasm? And you're certain of it because you just know the formula, the formula of quieting down her mind and touching her in a way that most guys will never touch her, and she will look at you like, “Where have you been my whole life?”

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: And when you know you can do that, you don’t really feel intimidated by other guys either.

[Angel Donovan]: Yeah, it definitely makes a huge difference once you know that in yourself. Some of the other points you went over there is like, you know, it seems like all it is about is really making more of an effort. The way I kind of see it is that maybe because men, you know, in a relationship, they start focusing more on work and stresses and the other things going on in life. They get a bit too tired and they stop making as much effort in the beginning, but in the beginning they all weren't really engaging with the experience. They're kind of lazy about it. There's also, you know, we were just talking about kind of the expectation, but there's also that I think they don’t realize how much effort they have to put into it to create that great experience, and so I think that's part of it as well. Is that one of the ways you think about it?

[Jason Julius]: Yeah, the kiss of death is getting comfortable, and that's applicable to any area of your life, you know. You get too comfortable in your sex life, you get comfortable just doing it missionary at night, you know, having your orgasm in about two or three minutes and going to bed because you're just kind of thinking about what you got to do to go to work the next day because maybe you have a job that you hate because you decided to get comfortable in that and not grow, and all those things kind of add up. It's not a lot of effort to actually continue to chase your woman in a relationship, to continue to be desirable, and that really just means continuing to grow as a person. When you become static and you don’t grow, your health starts to decline if you don’t do anything about it.

It's like working out. You start working out, you're kind of excited for the first couple of weeks, but then it becomes routine, you know, maybe it's time to change that up. It's not necessarily about being exciting with your workout, but a lot of people just quit. They just, “Yeah, you know,” they just become comfortable not working out. It's just really about continuing to grow and becoming something better than you are today, always, in all areas of your life.

[Angel Donovan]: As you were saying earlier, if you're not getting engaged with this experience, so she sees that you're putting less effort and you're just kind of like coming and then rolling over and that's kind of your main objective, you were talking earlier about how she starts to lose trust in you, and when you say that it kind of becomes obvious because like if you're not making an effort when you're having sex with her and you don’t really seem like you're engaged, because that's what really it is when you're just putting in so little effort, then why should she trust that you're invested and committed in the relationship? And maybe I guess she starts to think, “Well, maybe he's not interested in me.” Maybe she gets insecure about it. What do you think about that angle?

[Jason Julius]: Oh, I think it really comes down to desire. You know, when you're working on being good 10 years down the road, are you desirable to her? Are you a desirable person? And that really kind of becomes important in a woman orgasming. She has to really trust and respect you, first of all, and if you're someone who just really doesn’t care, you know, rolls over, has two-minute sex and goes to the shitty job you hate and you're just content in life, there's nothing exciting about that. But when you're somebody who’s growing, somebody who’s passionate, somebody that she finds desirable, she's going to feel desirable herself when you authentically show her that you find her desirable.

That's a really important point when you want to make a woman orgasm. She will feel desirable in the moments when she is certain that she is desired by a guy that she finds desirable. So you look at her and say, “Babe, you look so fucking sexy,” when you're a guy that she desires and you're saying that to her, oh my God, she can just melt and let you take her. But when she's already had sex with you for 10 years and she knows what’s coming and it's going to be another boring night and you just happen to say those words, it's not going to make her feel desirable that you're just telling her that you find her sexy. It's just not authentic. And so it really becomes about desire, because you want her to also be desirable 10 years from now. And women are so much better about working on this than men.

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: They hopefully keep themselves in great shape. You know, a lot of them become moms and at the same time they have so much to balance, but they're so good about keeping up on different chick stuff, and us guys are just like mopey, like, “Yeah, whatever, I’ll just get a beer gut and I’ll never have to worry about getting a woman again because I have this one I can roll over and have sex with.” Well, the evolution of the relationship just becomes static and it falls apart.

[Angel Donovan]: Mm-hmm. I mean, so how directly, like what kind of things would you see outside of the bedroom in the relationship when the sex isn't working?

[Jason Julius]: Some of the stuff I was saying earlier, I mean, she'll become more irritable with you, more inclined to start a fight and you might not know why. Little things might bother her that you're kind of like, “Whoa, if I would have said that to one of my guy friends he would have not even thought about it, but here she is just sensitive to it,” and she might not know why, and that can stem from her frustration in the bedroom. She doesn’t trust and respect you and it just starts to shine through her actions and how she treats you.

And a lot of guys would give women the power in the relationship, just totally hand over their power, totally like, “Babe, whatever makes you happy,” and she wants you to step up, have some balls and challenge her, you know? Like have some balls. And when you hand over the power, she's like, she's going to be inclined to take it because it's kind of really her only choice, but she doesn’t want that. And so it really starts to come through in her actions towards you, and she can become spiteful towards you.

[Angel Donovan]: Even spiteful sounds pretty strong, but like I'm sure a lot of guys can definitely relate to the irritability aspect of that, and eventually some relationships do end very spitefully, and it's interesting to think that that might stem from like this dynamic of sex and lack of trust and respect. So what do you think of the role of respect in sex? You've talked about it in potentially a different way to most guys would think. I think maybe guys are thinking, when you talk about respect when it comes to sex, they're thinking kind of like dominance and power. How would you describe the role of respect in sex?

[Jason Julius]: Um, yeah, it can mean a lot of different things. I would say her feeling like she's not going to be judged, a guy who is comfortable letting out his own sexuality and comfortable with his own turn-on, which allows her to be then comfortable with herself, and that's so important for her to let go and totally just get outside of her head and just let that thinking part of her brain turn off.

[Angel Donovan]: Mm-hmm.

[Jason Julius]: If she thinks she's going to be judged or if she just hasn’t built a level of comfort with you yet, she doesn’t know whether or not she can respect you yet, and that may inhibit her from having an orgasm until she feels that trust and respect, and really when you have a connection with a girl. And this is what I'm talking about, like I really like to meet a woman I really connect with and who I totally vibe with outside of the bedroom. It typically just builds this fun dynamic where a lot of that stuff is just built in.

[Angel Donovan]: Yeah.

[Jason Julius]: And when you just look at her and say, “You know, babe, I just want you to trust me and I want you to relax and I want to get to know every part of your body. I don’t want there to be any expectations. I want to be inside of you and I want to feel closer to you than anyone I've ever known in my life. I want you to just relax and give yourself to me.” That coming from a guy that she trusts and respects, again, that will make her melt. Don’t say that to a girl that you're just having a one-night stand with.

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: But with a girl that you're really connecting with, you can really build something from that. And that allows her mind to let go, and respect is such a big part of that.

[Angel Donovan]: Right. So this is like how to stop her thinking brain from working, which you said is key for the orgasm and getting engaged in sex. What other things can we do to stop her thinking brain engaging?

[Jason Julius]: Oh, there's actually a lot of stuff you can do. One of the most simple ways to do that is through massage. And so you give her a massage, and I'm talking about fully nude massage, but you don’t necessarily start it off sexual. You create an experience for her to just lay down and relax. And again, you can say, “Babe, I just want you to relax. You've had a tough day,” whatever, whatever’s going on, “and I just want to do this for you.” And you pull out the grape seed oil, which is a great massage oil, and proceed to just massage her in a nonsexual context, but you're both naked [laughs] and allow her to really get very, very deeply relaxed. And you can even go so far as to actually let her get close to falling asleep. It's so nonsexual. And the reason for that is there is a point right before you fall asleep, it's called threshold consciousness, and it's a point where you're not quite asleep yet but you're getting there and your thinking brain turns off. And so you're about to go into like a deeper sleep, you're still just about to fall asleep.

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: And when you transition from that, she's super-relaxed. You've really opened up her endorphin channels by rubbing down her body. And you don’t have to be an expert at massage necessarily to do this. It's just more about letting her mind relax and letting her physiology relax. But then after, say, maybe 15 minutes, maybe you have some music going on in the background, you gradually build that into a sexual context by kissing and licking down her back while she's on her stomach, and then moving all the way down to her ass gradually, since you already have grape seed oil on your hands, it's also my preferred lubricant for giving women orgasms, you can actually just transition massage right into touching her G-spot, her A-spot. But when she starts to tense up her body because the feeling will be pretty strong, pretty intense, you instruct her to relax. “I just want you to relax, babe. Just relax.” Stop what you're doing, just let her relax again, and then gradually go and coach her to relax, and don’t let her get out of that very deep relaxation. That is a really, really powerful way to get her to orgasm. It's not necessarily about the massage itself. It's just more about the state that it's putting her into.

[Angel Donovan]: Right, right, right.

[Jason Julius]: You know, she's required to be very relaxed, and [laughs] she will love you just for doing that for her. And then if you give her an orgasm after that, you can expect some pretty intense sex after that. [Laughs]

[Angel Donovan]: So to give guys a really clear idea of this, like how long should they be massaging her for to get her relaxed or should they be paying attention to signals so she looks like she's literally going to fall asleep?

[Jason Julius]: Yeah, I was going to say it might just really depend on the woman. You know, she’s someone who’s high-strung and has a hard time relaxing, you might notice her in the first five or 10 minutes she's hardly relaxing and you might have to keep reminding her to. It helps to have some like really super-chill music in the background, and that will help her mind start to relax. A lot of times women don’t like the whole focus to be on them. Women are typically more givers than receivers. So in a lot of ways what you're doing is you're sort of training her mind to be okay with receiving, because in the sexual context we should both be okay with giving as well as receiving.

But a lot of women don’t feel comfortable with that. It brings out a lot of insecurities. And again, when she trusts and respects that you're going to guide her and lead her, she'll have a lot easier time just relaxing and letting go. I mean, this is fun for her when you're that guy. This is like a dream to her to have this guy taking control. She's relaxing. There's no expectation. Because expectation of orgasm is one of the worse ways to go about things because it will totally inhibit her ability to orgasm. So one of the fatal mistakes guys do when they learn like a G-spot technique or something like that, they’ll be like, “Hey, I know this super-cool technique and I'm going to give you a full body orgasm,” You know?

[Angel Donovan]: [Laughs]

[Jason Julius]: And she's like, “You're going to do what?”

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: She has no idea what he's talking about and suddenly there's all this pressure put on her to orgasm, and what we talked about earlier is if she's thinking too much, you know, if that thinking part of her brain is engaged, then her body’s not going to do what it wants to do naturally and let go in orgasm. That quieting of the mind is so important.

[Angel Donovan]: Right. And what I was thinking of, like because I can definitely see how some women would kind of fight you on it, you know, especially if they're kind of stressed. So if they're further away from this relaxation state, they're going to fight you more when it comes to this massage. I'm sure a lot of guys can just think about that for themselves as well, like when they're more stressed, in a way you don’t feel like having a massage because you've got too much going on, it's kind of like you don’t want to sleep when you've got a lot going on in your head as well, because you're not in the right state to kind of acknowledge you need it. I was thinking about like other ways, like would you say you could sell it to her? Like how would you handle that kind of situation?

I'm saying selling is because like actually one of my good friends when we used to work together, he used to bring out like the massage thing and I’ll be like, “I've got a lot of work though,” but he used to do a very good job of selling it to me in different ways and we’d just end up going to the massage place and relaxing, and afterwards I’d be like, “It's great we've done this,” right? And after that point I started taking girls to the massage place, and in some cases I would have to kind of sell the idea to them, you know, especially if I didn't know them that well. But you know, afterwards they loved it, and of course, as you say, that put them in a great state of mind for having great sex afterwards.

So what would you say about these more difficult like situations where they're more stressed, and what do you think of the idea of kind of selling the concept to them and being kind of a bit more forceful about it?

[Jason Julius]: That may just be the moment that she's in. You know, you don’t want to go against the grain. If she's like super-stressed out and just like, “Get your hands off me, I'm just really stressed out right now,” of course you're not going to go against the grain.

[Angel Donovan]: Right. Right.

[Jason Julius]: A big thing too is building anticipation, you know, like texting her during the day and saying, “Babe, I can't wait to have my hands all over you. I have something planned tonight and I can't tell you what it is, but I cannot wait to explore every inch of your body,” and that might just set her off like, “Oh my God, what’s he going to do for me?” and get her all excited. And I don't know a lot of women that get too overly against full body massage, maybe if they're very self-conscious…

[Angel Donovan]: Yeah.

[Jason Julius]: …but most of them will be like, “Holy shit, no guy has ever done this for me,” and in most instances she's probably going to be pretty acceptable of it. I like that you brought up the fact of actually taking her to go get a massage because if you don’t like to give her a massage, I mean, it can help to get her super-relaxed. One of my ex-girlfriends from back when I used to live in Las Vegas, her and I used to go get couples massages and she absolutely loved them, and I loved it because then she would be so relaxed. She would squirt like crazy all night long and I didn't have to do much work. The funny thing is it might sound like a lot of work to give her a massage but it's very rare that you do it and she's, one, against it, and it's actually very rare that you do it and she doesn’t give you one, you know?

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: It's kind of funny that like she wants to also repay the favor, and if you want to be really relaxed for a blowjob or if you're self-conscious about being a receiver even, tell her to give you a massage. Tell her you're stressed out and just be really relaxed and have her give you that experience where she takes you from massage to blowjob, and the crazy thing is…

[Angel Donovan]: [Laughs]

[Jason Julius]: …like you get outside of your head and you get to kind of experience what I mean by being outside of your head, because being inside your own head fucks up your orgasm too – it's just you're more programmed to ejaculate. Had men not been programmed to ejaculate easier, our species probably would not exist today. So we can still get a boner pretty easily and orgasm—some guys orgasm too quickly [laughs]—you know, but it's something to experience for yourself, because then you get to understand what it means to relax and be outside of your head and accept pleasure for yourself.

[Angel Donovan]: Right, and you'll get more out of the experience, and as you say, you'll experience different things when you're in this better mental state, because when we're relaxed we get more out of it as well. And you know, right at the beginning of this we were talking about making more of an effort. Like a lot of this is just about making the effort. It's not complicated. It's just you have to make the effort. And for a lot of guys it seems like, in relationships especially, they're not motivated. Potentially some of that is because they're not accessing this relaxed state and understanding these different dimensions of sex, and there's a lot more reward in it biologically, emotionally, and so on for…in that. So that's where maybe they're missing out on some of the motivation.

[Jason Julius]: They are, and I think a lot of times maybe they're like, if they're so deep into a relationship, 10 years, whatever, and she's maybe not keeping up on herself, they're like, “Why should I?” the fact of the matter is you should go first. She will be inspired if you start working on yourself, you know, start teaching her things. I mean, there's nothing that, you know, proves to her that you're the leader than to teach her stuff about herself. Part of that could be teaching her how to eat better. Another part of it could be teaching her how to have a full body orgasm. I mean, how excited is she going to be now about sex when she can have more orgasms than you do? It's about going first. It's about chasing her and being able to see her in a new light, not stick to the murky idea that she doesn’t want sex or that she is against it. She probably wants it just as much as you do. It's just you have to go first.

[Angel Donovan]: We talked about reassuring women during sex, which also helps them to not be so nervous about it so that she's not being judged, for instance – one of the specific things you brought up. What other ways would you reassure her during sex and why is it important?

[Jason Julius]: Oh, that's a really good question because, particularly during oral sex, that is a very vulnerable position for a woman. Us guys, you know, we dive, put our heads down there, and don’t really think about what she might be thinking self-consciously. That's vulnerable, man. I mean, you have your mouth and your lips down in a part of her body that she might be self-conscious about. So just reassuring her how bad you want to taste her as you are working your way down there, “Oh, you taste so fucking good,” once you're licking her pussy, tell her, “Oh babe, you taste so fucking good. Oh my God, I can't get enough of you,” and not even just during that time but in the text message you send her the next day say, “Oh my God, you tasted so good. I'm getting hard just thinking about it…”

[Angel Donovan]: That's amazing.

[Jason Julius]: …you know, telling her those kinds of things gets her over that self-consciousness and, again, allows her mind to relax.

[Angel Donovan]: Yeah. Yeah, very great point there. What other ways could you…and whatever situations do you think it's important to reassure women, you know, I don't know, different positions or, you know, some other specific scenarios which might come up and men might be missing where she needs a bit more reassurance?

[Jason Julius]: I think it's positive reinforcement. I think just as beings, as animals, so to speak, that we are, we like to be praised for doing something good. If she sucks your dick good, tell her what you liked about it and tell her that she did it good and reinforce that about her or about what she did, because we're more likely to do stuff where we feel good about it than things that we're uncertain about. So if you want to have her give you more blowjobs, make her feel good about it. Be like, “Babe, you look so sexy with my dick in your mouth.” She'll want to do it all the time because she's like, “Oh yeah, I'm really good at this,” and you reap the reward of more sloppy blowjobs just because she feels good about it.

And you know, maybe she is on top of you, riding you in a certain way, you just say, “Babe, when you're riding me like that, I can't hold myself back. I want to come inside of you so bad when you do that,” and she'll be like, “Yeah, I got him right there.” And it's positive reinforcement. It just makes her feel good about it and she wants to do it more often, and it can alleviate some of her anxieties about her performance because she has them too. It's just about reassuring her in all things.

And again, it's just about taking the effort to do that. Sex is so taboo. A lot of couples, they're just like, boom, quick and over and they don't talk about it, you know. It's like, “Maybe it's going to happen again tomorrow night.” Make it that amazing world that the two of you share and talk about and get excited about, and then she gets to open up and really share some of her naughty side with you, and that's when you get to really see her for who she is sexually without any of the inhibition and you feel more comfortable being yourself with her too.

[Angel Donovan]: Yeah, it sounds like, I mean, and maybe a lot of this is due to guys holding back as well, you know, they don’t feel like…they do feel it's good and they like seeing something, but in a way they're a bit shy or they're just holding back because they're a bit defensive and, you know, you are obviously like going pretty deep psychologically. You know, it sounds like a good mindset would be just like whenever you feel good, just take the opportunity to communicate that where it's like actively saying things with positive reinforcement like that, or even, I don't know what you think this, is like just making noises like, you know, obviously like, you know, when you're making noises the girl can tell that you're really enjoying it.

[Jason Julius]: Absolutely. I don't know if you've ever noticed this, but women are way more vocal during sex than men are.

[Angel Donovan]: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

[Jason Julius]: And so yeah, I mean if you actually make a point to actually do it, I mean, we could really dive deep into like the weird nature of why women are like that.

[Angel Donovan]: [Laughs]

[Jason Julius]: I mean, there's all kinds of speculation as to that it's almost supposed to be a call for more men to hear that she's having sex and have the whole pscyhology going on. But, I mean, women who are uninhibited will scream and make so much noise, and they relate that to their pleasure.

[Angel Donovan]: Yup.

[Jason Julius]: I think a lot of guys have a hard time—I do. I mean, sometimes I just don’t even realize how quiet I am about it…

[Angel Donovan]: Right.

[Jason Julius]: …and how much more uninhibited I could be if I actually just let go. And that's a scary thing. I mean, it's not even something guys probably really want to admit, but it's kind of a weird thing to like just fully be uninhibited and just moan and let it out.

[Angel Donovan]: And I think, you know, you've obviously come across some uninhibited women and you've experienced that, but I just think it's worth talking about that a bit more to give guys a clearer idea, because before I got into all of this, you know, I guess like the women had been a lot more inhibited, the ones I was with and in my relationships and so on. As I started exploring I came across more women which were a lot less inhibited. And at first it's kind of scary, and if you have flatmates they talk about it, [laughs] because there's the screaming and shouting, and maybe she's like shouting out dirty words like, “Fuck me harder, fuck me harder,” you know, I mean she's really yelling it, right? And so like for guys who haven't been through that they might find this extreme, but I like the way you put, it's just like uninhibited and she's really fully enjoying that.

[Jason Julius]: Absolutely. There's not a better lesson in the world for a guy who’s uncertain about himself in the bedroom than to be with a woman who’s sexually confident. I mean, that is the best lesson you could have because you have a woman there that vocally shows you when you're doing things right, may even vocally tell you when you're doing things wrong, and will teach you things.

And that comes down to being choosy. I mean, sometimes we don’t think about that enough when we're like just trying to pick up a woman. Like she might be young and cute and things like that, but she may not be that comfortable with her sexuality, and that's okay.

[Angel Donovan]: Mm-hmm.

[Jason Julius]: As you build a relationship with her you have the opportunity to bring that out of her. But a lot of times I love confident women for that fact that they're sexually challenging, they're sexually fresh and they're new, and that in of itself is like a qualification thing right when you're meeting her, you know, how confident is she in herself? And as you become a guy who really works on yourself all the time and you get into so many nonsense points, you really notice little subtleties in women, clues so to speak, that she might be pretty confident in herself. All women have a high sex drive. They do. Some of them don't know that they do, but you can bring that out, and it's just so much more fun when she already knows that she does.

[Angel Donovan]: Right, right. Yeah, and as you say, it will really help to reset kind of your expectations, right? And understanding of, you know, what an inhibited woman is so that then you can, like, you know, if you do get into a relationship with a more inhibited girl, you can like think, “Okay, well, I should help her to become less inhibited and to enjoy this more,” because until you've had that kind of reference experience of how kind of crazy women can get in bed, to put it in one way, or I think it's better to just let them go wild and get into their true self, you know, just getting into their spirit when they're in it. So you know, that reference experience can really help, and I was just thinking as you're talking there that there may be a bias – older women may tend to be less inhibited. It's not always true, but you know, if you're dating a 21-year-old, it's more likely that she might need a bit more coaching on that aspect. What are your thoughts about that?

[Jason Julius]: Oh, exactly. I think women a lot of times until they hit their upper 20s or 30s are not really fully engaged in their sexuality, so to speak. I mean, they are but they really start to hit their sexual peak in their 30s and they are experienced enough to know. Hopefully, generations from now people are more sexually aware in a healthy way, you know, to where young women understand where those good feelings come from and are totally comfortable with their sexuality and unapologetic about the fact that they want good sex. It doesn’t mean they sleep around. It just means that they want great sex. It's an enjoyable part of our humanity. But you know, it just really depends on the woman, because there are so many women that are in their 30s and 40s who are just as locked up sexually as the 21-year-old because there's so much shame and stuff around sex. So it just really depends on the woman that you're with.

[Angel Donovan]: Okay, so man, thanks, you know, we've done a good tour and I've made a few notes as we're going into this, like about other stuff that would have been great to talk about, but we're running out of time here. So I'd like to finish off with the question we ask everyone, which is if a guy wants to improve this aspect of his life as quickly as possible, what would be the top three things you would suggest he works on? What are your top three recommendations for him?

[Jason Julius]: I would say top of the list is working on becoming sexually masterful, so to speak, learning a woman’s body and mind, getting over any issues you might have with your own sexuality, whether that be anxieties and fears around sex and maybe learning how to last longer, and just overall becoming really confident in your ability in the bedroom. That means nothing to do with your size or your manhood or anything like that. That really is not something that really comes into play too much as far as your sexuality. It's actually about being able to be comfortable in who you are, be unapologetic about your own sexuality and just really enjoy giving women orgasms and understanding all the different areas, how to touch her and how to really get her mind into the moment. I would say that would be on the top of the list.

Other than that, I think it's really about going to work on yourself as a guy. And so number two on the list would probably be going to work real hard on building your career or your business or whatever you're into. Make you an interesting person because of your experience.

I was at a conference not too long ago where Eben Pagan was speaking— he's David Deangelo in the dating world—and he said if he was to go back and make another dating product, he said he would probably do it in a way where he would actually teach guys to work on themselves to become that guy instead of trying to have so many different lines and things. It's a little bit longer journey but you get so much more of a reward. You see a lot of guys 10 years into learning how to pick up women, so to speak, and they still live at their mom’s house, they’ve memorized so many pickup lines that it just flows out of them, maybe they have a lot of experience and they're good at picking up women, but they don’t have the other areas in their life really intact, and inevitably they live in a home or they just don’t really have a passion towards anything else other than picking up women. So going to work on yourself on whatever else you're passionate about, and that doesn’t just mean your career, that might be learning Chinese because you really want to help a charitable organization in China, or something like that, you know, like it's something you're just so passionate about or something that really moves you, I would say that would be number two on the list.

And number would be just really maintaining your health. There's a lot of—we could go off for hours about this, but—there's a lot of misinformation about health and fitness that is leading so many people to become obese and out of shape and all that kind of stuff. You know, for yourself to be healthy sexually in the long-term, you really need to know how your body is reacting and what it is telling you to eat, you have to go through periods of time where you eat properly, and knowing how to work out because lifting weights is such an important part of triggering testosterone, especially as you get older. Learning how to properly lift weights, build muscle – that's an important part of the puzzle for your long-term sex life and being able to maintain your youthfulness, your stamina, so to speak, and really kick up your sex drive.

So knowing all those things are just as important. And when you're passionate about knowing that stuff, then women are going to really feel that from you, and those things really all combine to make you a really intriguing person and a very attractive guy.

[Angel Donovan]: Those were excellent points, counterintuitive, something… and like a lot of them were kind of original, not stuff that we've heard before. I know around the, I mean the second one in particular guys don't think about, and as you say, it's a long-term thing, and so it's kind of tough to get people to start working on that and seeing the value in it, but it's so true, and everyone has been working on this for a while, we'll say that.

And the third one, I know that, you know, on the third area, that's something that I deeply believe in the biological aspect that contributes to sex. And I know that you've got a course coming up to look at that pretty soon. Do you want to say a couple of words about that?

[Jason Julius]: Sure, yeah. I mean, that's been sort of my obsession for the last couple of years, to sort of figure out why do so many guys start to lose their sex drive as they get older? Because it's unfortunate, you know? We're…don’t really hit their peak of sexuality until, you know, they're in their like late 30s.

[Angel Donovan]: Yeah.

[Jason Julius]: How can a guy maintain that sexual drive and energy and all that kind of stuff? So I actually created a course called Extreme Sex Drive, all about understanding those variables that allow your sex drive to go up and down, so to speak. So long story short, when you're up until about 25 years old you get this rush of hormones and you're horny no matter what, and after that your sex drive becomes more influenced by what you do – so what you eat, how you work out. That means a lot of people excessively work out and it actually works against them because stress hormones will actually kill your sex drive…

[Angel Donovan]: Totally.

[Jason Julius]: Then there is other minimal stuff like lifting weights in a certain way. And then, also, most people don’t realize that your testosterone is created in your body when you sleep, so getting proper sleep and all those kinds of things and rest and different recovery techniques, so to speak. So that's been pretty much my obsession and I kind of combined it all into a real minimalist approach to what’s the minimal amount of stuff that you need to do, and then where you can actually take it to the extreme level is where I talk a little bit about supplementation, but more or less just how you can trigger more your own sex drive without really having to do much at all. It's just about lifestyle tweaks.

[Angel Donovan]: Well, like as I said before we started this interview, I'm really glad you're bringing that course out because, as I've said, I've been waiting for that course to come out in this market for a while. I've been tampering with that stuff for the last two or three years myself and it's made a huge difference to my life. You know, really looking forward to check that one out and review it for the guys, and I'm sure it's going to be good stuff. So thanks for this interview today, man. It's been a great delve into sex and relationships, and very insightful.

[Jason Julius]: Absolutely. Thanks a lot, man.